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Old 01-27-2009, 09:25 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

Sully, I did some research on the Calcium in this protein (actually stopped use while researching) and found it to be less than .005% of the whey. I will double check, this was after to the math, percentage of daily value at 14% for a 2,000 calorie human diet by the 24.3 g serving (not giving her this amount).
As for food, I am in the process of converting to before B.G. grain #2 (Salmon), a grain free kibble with multiple meat sources, sweet potato, Acai etc etc (www.merrickpetcare.com).
Hanna, this one is loaded with fish omega 3 ...please tell me I am doing right for my pup I want to now get into the training and just enjoying her company knowing she will most likely be healthy.
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Old 01-27-2009, 10:37 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

So whey, a product from cow's milk, is .005% calcium? Hmmmm....if that's true, I think you're getting ripped off

The daily recommended value for humans for calcium is 1000 mg. 14% of that is 140 mg. So 140 mg in one scoop, so say you feed him a quarter of a scoop a day that is still 35 mg of calcium. Which really isn't that much but for a a small puppy, it's worth noting. Also it's tough to tell what the phosphorus amounts would be, whey powders don't usually include this in the ingredients.

You seem hellbent on feeding whey protein to your dog, and that's fine. Chances are it's not going to do any serious damage but just as questionable will be any benefits. We can both agree that too much of quality protein is not a problem for dogs. AFter all, in the wild wolves eat almost all meat and bone, which results in a very high protein diet. The grey area is what do we consider "quality" proteins? Some will say high-end kibbles meet the criteria, others would argue that any kibble is unnatural and from questionable sources. Now for the sake of argument we'll say whey is a quality protein, but kibble is less than desirable. Now combine the 2 and you're feeding a high protein diet that is mostly made up of less than desirable protein source. Suddenly your dog is no longer in the quality high protein diet. That small percentage of quality (ie whey) may actually be hurting you when you consider the rest of the diet.

What we're really talking about is this: is it better for your dog to have a mediocre diet low in protein, or a slightly higher quality diet with high protein?

If I had to gamble, I would put my money on the lower proten diet because it's less likely to cause problems. It's unlikely the risk is worth the reward. I am certainly not adverse to whey (hey I take it myself daily) but it's not magic. What you really should be comparing is kibble vs. raw, not kibble vs. kibble + whey. I guess I'm just not sure what your goal is, to bulk up your puppy or just make him extra healthy? Because theres little doubt that a raw diet would be optimal, and any other combo you want to come up with is only going to fall short.
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Old 01-27-2009, 11:36 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

Thanks for your input Sully. I actually would prefer raw over kibble, but we have someone in the home on immunosupresent drugs and a raw food in the home is too dangerous for their health. The process of Whey (at least my product) has a process known to retain the protein qualities similar to a unprocessed or uncooked food, not to mention containing all proteins available not found in fish or poultry without the bad ingredients in red meat protein. It is not a shot in the dark I am interested in this backed with good logic so I would not say being bent on this is a bad thing. And no I do not want to bulk her up as my purpose for whey, I want her healthy. Also want to add, it was always my understanding that increased protein increased calcium and fat causing issues in kibble in the past...maybe why such a fear of protein even if proven to not cause the problems initially it was accused of?
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Old 01-28-2009, 10:54 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

i did research on fighting dogs at one point. in that world it is very common to supplement with protein powders, both whey and egg powders. however these dogs are in training and the purpose is to build muscle.
i also believe i read somewhere that sled dogs are fed a whey based protein supplement.

i in no way endorse the use of dogs for fighting. please dont let my comments change the topic of the thread. my comments are only to show that protein supplements are used in the K-9 world. though unless i was trying to bulk up a dog for whatever reason i dont see it benefiting the average house dog.

i'll also add that i feed my first boxer a high protein eukanuba kibble beginning at 9 weeks. at about 6 months he started just laying around. it appeared hard for him to walk. when he did walk it was very slowly and occasionally he would yelp in pain. when i took him to the vet he diagnosed him as having grown too fast (cant think of the actual name, this was 20 years ago) he said i needed to feed him a lower protein food and eventually he would grow out of it. he was right eventually he did become a normal boxer. at adulthood he was no bigger than any other boxer i had seen.
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Old 01-28-2009, 11:37 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

Thanks for the information strutter. I have heard this before, but considering the life of a fighting dog I did not consider their strategies important to healthy life over in the "now results" mindset of many fighters. I have taken in two pits in my time that where older from the pound and find these dogs to be up there with boxers as a great family dog and it just sucks their bad name has created strict rules against them even under good ownership. By the way I fed those Solid Gold when you needed to add minerals separately...k sorry, back to boxers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by strutter
i'll also add that i feed my first boxer a high protein eukanuba kibble beginning at 9 weeks. at about 6 months he started just laying around. it appeared hard for him to walk. when he did walk it was very slowly and occasionally he would yelp in pain. when i took him to the vet he diagnosed him as having grown too fast (cant think of the actual name, this was 20 years ago) he said i needed to feed him a lower protein food and eventually he would grow out of it. he was right eventually he did become a normal boxer. at adulthood he was no bigger than any other boxer i had seen.
Growing too fast issues has been proven not effected by protein as once believed...and sometimes still believed by old info. It is the bone growth influenced by calcium and related nutrients causing developmental bone problems. I take it this food did not have deboned meat and/or too much calcium? Many food companies agree, if you can increase protein without increasing calcium/phosphorus that is a good thing. If that food is still around I would love to look into it as that is very scary to have a sick dog like that. The part about being no bigger is good for us, I am not trying to get her big, we actually have a weight limit here so I want her no bigger, strong and healthy like her name states.
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Old 01-30-2009, 02:07 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

Quote:
Originally Posted by bowfinger
If that food is still around I would love to look into it as that is very scary to have a sick dog like that.
it was eukanuba hi pro. in a solid pink bag. back then it was considered the best. it was $55 a bag 20 years ago. i know eukanuba still makes kibble. but surely the formulation has changed over the years. i havent used any eukanuba since then
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Old 01-31-2009, 04:41 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: by Nature Organics / Whey Protein

Thanks Strutter. It seems eukanuba has gone up and down on its credibility and their diets have changed with the information of the times. Their website has some good information on diet and it seems to be they are at least now fairly hip to the more recent food trends backed by study. I found other products for kibble I liked better but I think eukanuba has a good product line at least right now. All the money we place in Nasa and finding life in outerspace, you would think diet understanding would be past its infancy stage
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Old 01-31-2013, 02:29 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Talking organic whey

organic whey :- Best organic whey protein on the market today. #1 choice in taste test.

organic whey protein :- Best organic whey protein on the market today. #1 choice in taste test.
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