Bedford Reg'd - advice on breeder - Page 3 - Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums
Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums
Go Back   Boxer Forum : Boxer Breed Dog Forums > About Boxers and Breeders > Breeding Info > Finding a Breeder

BoxerForums.com is the premier Boxer Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-03-2013, 04:53 PM   #21 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaharaNight Boxers View Post
They all health test their breeding dogs and I believe all of them show in Conformation aka dog shows. They all truly care about the breed and want to further the breed and to help its health. Backyard breeders or BYB's don't. They're the random family that decides to have a litter because their female dog is cute, or sweet, etc. and they don't do any health testing or make sure she's up to standard. This is not where you want to get a puppy from.

Here's a few more breeders too. This is for western Ontario.
BCWO - welcome!!


Sent from Petguide.com Free App
All of your comments are unfounded, slanderous and without knowing me, or my dogs, you really shouldn't give out advice on a public forum. It is very unprofessional. I am NOT a backyard breeder, nor do I breed on a "whim". If that were the case, I would breed regardless of whether I had individuals (strangers) interested or not. In my case, I only wanted to breed if there were enough individuals that I already knew, interested, as I find placing them in good homes very stressful. My dogs are 100% European and are from the highest quality bloodlines. The father of my boy is the 2008 World Winner Champion Twinkle Star v.Eurozone and is THE MOST HEALTH TESTED BOXER IN THE WORLD: *** Eurozone Boxer kennel, Ch.Twinkle Star v.Eurozone, European Boxer with unique pedigree . The father of my girl is owned by a dog show judge, is health tested and is a CRUFTS winner. The mothers of my dogs are health tested and are show dogs as well. Not only are you insulting me, but you are insulting these breeders too! If I were a back yard breeder, or didn't care about my dogs or my puppies, I would NOT have gone through the expense and trouble to import from a reputable breeder in Europe! I would have gotten my dogs from a mill or back yard breeder who doesn't health test and would have gotten the cheapest dogs I could find. My TWO Boxers are FAMILY COMPANIONS. Period. I do not consider myself a "Boxer Breeder", as I will no longer be breeding Boxers, as I find placing them in loving homes very stressful. I have been involved with Bostons since 2001 and placing a Boston Terrier is nothing like placing a Boxer. After all, a Boston isn't at risk of being adopted out for guard work. As it appears that you consider yourself an expert, you would know that there is a HUGE difference in type between the North American (NA) Boxer and the European Boxer and that European Boxers generally do not do well in the show rings in North America. We started showing our boy and were disappointed that he didn't do as well as the NA Boxers. That doesn't mean he's not worthy. I myself prefer a European Boxer and I shouldn't be faulted for that, nor should individuals who prefer to adopt a Boxer of this type be either. As for Schutzhund, my hat goes off to those involved, but I am not personally interested in putting my dog in that kind of sport and I am not interested in my dog learning to do that or seeing that. My dogs are members of the family and are couch dogs and that is the way I prefer it. I have that right to decide the sports I wish to engage in with my dogs and shouldn't be judged for it. I show my own Bostons, as well as I show for others and I have produced many Champions; Canadian, Slovakian, Danish & International Champions. As you would also know, different continents/countries tend to have different health problems/more of a problem with some things than others and I have followed the protocols of my dogs' breeder, based on the prevalence of these problems in their country. That being said, if I were to continue breeding Boxers, I would indeed get into more exhaustive heart testing, ARVC testing, etc. My dogs are almost five years old, are healthy, have no murmurs and are retiring. As you know, there are no guarantees with any dog, whether from tested or non-tested lines, which is where guarantees come in and a promise to stand by the owner and do the right thing by them. I start my puppies out on health insurance, in case of accidents (as one of the forums members had and was able to use) and I guarantee my pups - not just a blanket puppy replacement, but money back (if they decide to keep their puppy) as well if they choose. As for the previous posting stating I don't know how to tape ears, where does that come from? I have taped many ears, so I don't know what qualifies you to say this and I think it is very nasty.
BedfordReg'd is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-03-2013, 05:03 PM   #22 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Default

What exactly about my dogs or me brings up red flags for you?
BedfordReg'd is offline  
Old 03-03-2013, 06:03 PM   #23 (permalink)
Advanced User
 
SaharaNight Boxers's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 907
Default Bedford Reg'd - advice on breeder

Quote:
Originally Posted by BedfordReg'd View Post
All of your comments are unfounded, slanderous and without knowing me, or my dogs, you really shouldn't give out advice on a public forum. It is very unprofessional. I am NOT a backyard breeder, nor do I breed on a "whim". If that were the case, I would breed regardless of whether I had individuals (strangers) interested or not. In my case, I only wanted to breed if there were enough individuals that I already knew, interested, as I find placing them in good homes very stressful. My dogs are 100% European and are from the highest quality bloodlines. The father of my boy is the 2008 World Winner Champion Twinkle Star v.Eurozone and is THE MOST HEALTH TESTED BOXER IN THE WORLD: *** Eurozone Boxer kennel, Ch.Twinkle Star v.Eurozone, European Boxer with unique pedigree . The father of my girl is owned by a dog show judge, is health tested and is a CRUFTS winner. The mothers of my dogs are health tested and are show dogs as well. Not only are you insulting me, but you are insulting these breeders too! If I were a back yard breeder, or didn't care about my dogs or my puppies, I would NOT have gone through the expense and trouble to import from a reputable breeder in Europe! I would have gotten my dogs from a mill or back yard breeder who doesn't health test and would have gotten the cheapest dogs I could find. My TWO Boxers are FAMILY COMPANIONS. Period. I do not consider myself a "Boxer Breeder", as I will no longer be breeding Boxers, as I find placing them in loving homes very stressful. I have been involved with Bostons since 2001 and placing a Boston Terrier is nothing like placing a Boxer. After all, a Boston isn't at risk of being adopted out for guard work. As it appears that you consider yourself an expert, you would know that there is a HUGE difference in type between the North American (NA) Boxer and the European Boxer and that European Boxers generally do not do well in the show rings in North America. We started showing our boy and were disappointed that he didn't do as well as the NA Boxers. That doesn't mean he's not worthy. I myself prefer a European Boxer and I shouldn't be faulted for that, nor should individuals who prefer to adopt a Boxer of this type be either. As for Schutzhund, my hat goes off to those involved, but I am not personally interested in putting my dog in that kind of sport and I am not interested in my dog learning to do that or seeing that. My dogs are members of the family and are couch dogs and that is the way I prefer it. I have that right to decide the sports I wish to engage in with my dogs and shouldn't be judged for it. I show my own Bostons, as well as I show for others and I have produced many Champions; Canadian, Slovakian, Danish & International Champions. As you would also know, different continents/countries tend to have different health problems/more of a problem with some things than others and I have followed the protocols of my dogs' breeder, based on the prevalence of these problems in their country. That being said, if I were to continue breeding Boxers, I would indeed get into more exhaustive heart testing, ARVC testing, etc. My dogs are almost five years old, are healthy, have no murmurs and are retiring. As you know, there are no guarantees with any dog, whether from tested or non-tested lines, which is where guarantees come in and a promise to stand by the owner and do the right thing by them. I start my puppies out on health insurance, in case of accidents (as one of the forums members had and was able to use) and I guarantee my pups - not just a blanket puppy replacement, but money back (if they decide to keep their puppy) as well if they choose. As for the previous posting stating I don't know how to tape ears, where does that come from? I have taped many ears, so I don't know what qualifies you to say this and I think it is very nasty.
First, I don't consider myself an expert. I know I'm always learning and I don't have enough experience. But, from what I have learned I can make opinions.

Second, you took this out of context. He asked what was different about the breeders in the clubs versus random breeders. This was never directed at you.

Third, you only have an auscultation and hips done on your dogs and most would agree this isn't enough. Boxers are 187th, last time I saw, on the list for hip dysplacia. They are extremely high, if not highest for heart disease. An auscultation isn't enough to breed. There should at least be a holter. And along with appropriate health tests for different countries there also could've been JRD testing since it is more prevalent in European Boxers.

Fourth, I know first hand trying to show a different type of Boxer and don't totally agree. My natural ear boy is being shown right now and although it is harder if he deserves it and its a fair judge I know he can win. Canada is also much more open to different types of dogs being shown. There are also quite a few finished European or UK dogs in North America.

The original poster asked for opinions and he got them. That's what a forum is for. Maybe it'd be best to close this thread?

P.S. It looks like you took down that one part that said you'd breed again if people wanted to buy. That's what I was referring to as breeding for the buyers.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App

Last edited by SaharaNight Boxers; 03-03-2013 at 06:07 PM.
SaharaNight Boxers is offline  
 
Old 03-03-2013, 08:13 PM   #24 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Default

Yes, you have a right to your opinion, but not having enough testing is different than not having any testing at all. Everyone could do more testing always. I was just getting started in Boxers when it quickly became apparent that I cannot handle the stress of placing the puppies (hence, wanting to have enough of my family, friends and previous owners to warrant it!), as it proved to be very different than what I'm used to. I did my best and I started with good dogs, with good pedigrees and healthy bloodlines and I did what I understood was the basic requirements to start with, before breeding, with the information and recommendations I had at that time. While OFA cardiac may not be enough for today's standards, it was my understanding at that time, was that most serious heart defects often present as a murmur. Probably not all, but I don't think the OFA certification isn't completely useless. Things have changed a lot in the last six years as to what the bottom line is for testing and the list of tests are increasing. A while ago I ordered the DNA ARVC swabs and have recently found out that the DNA tests are not definitive and don't mean anything at all now? I realize that heart is an issue in the breed - so much so that in some parts of the world, low grade heart murmurs are "breedable". I DON'T agree with this and feel that no grade of any problem should be acceptable. Boxers are #33 on OFA's list of breeds, for heart problems and they are #96 (not #187) for HD, so I myself do not view HD testing as "optional". Bottom line, obviously if my dogs weren't retiring and I was starting in the breed now, I would do all the currently recommended tests...I have experience showing as well and where we are in Ontario, the Euros do not do well at all. I am not the only one with this experience. I do not pretend to know what happens in the States in the Boxer show ring, but I know how it is here. The UK Boxers are a different type however and they do better than the Euros. The ONLY reason why I cropped my dogs' ears was so I could show them - showing five years ago is not the same as showing now; natural ears are becoming more accepted in light of the cropping/docking ban debate. My boy's ears went up fine, but I had to take my female to a different Vet at 11 weeks (I was told it wasn't too late) and they did a hack job on her and cut down past the bell of her ear and into her neck. It was a mess and yes, I did stop taping after a while, as her health was more important. I wasn't going to risk her losing an ear. I feel like the whole discussion about me not being able to tape ears was inappropriate. After all, my boy's ears are up...Yes, I took it down because if there are other people out there who are going to mis-read it and take IT in the wrong context as you did, I don't want that. I am breeding for my family, friends and previous owners and I would be irresponsible if I bred without a thought or consideration as to where these pups will go. Is it not irresponsible for a breeder to breed if they don't have a waiting list? How could you get that I am doing it on a whim if I want to make sure I have a waiting list? That makes no sense? If I were doing it on a "whim", I wouldn't care if I had a waiting list or not? I am sorry if you feel that I took your comments out of context, but it is hard not to, when the title of the discussion took place under the heading Bedford Reg'd, with regards to backyard breeders, showing, lack of testing, etc. coupled with comments of "red flags", "do not go with this breeder", "breeding on a whim", etc. I do not want to be in the same category, or text box as backyard breeders, BYBs, etc. While yes, you are entitled to your opinion, I just wish it was done in a more objective way is all. There were some comments that were not necessary, not objective and I felt my integrity was called into question. I think closing the thread is a great idea.
BedfordReg'd is offline  
Old 03-03-2013, 10:06 PM   #25 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 17
Default

I have messaged the site moderator to remove the thread.
svince is offline  
Old 03-04-2013, 01:15 PM   #26 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Default

Thank-you. I will do the same!
BedfordReg'd is offline  
Old 03-04-2013, 01:51 PM   #27 (permalink)
Advanced User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 834
Default

I really don't think anyone said anything accusatory... Just a blanket statement made about breeders in general.
Think offence was taken where none was applied...just sayin'
canadianjem is offline  
Old 03-04-2013, 02:33 PM   #28 (permalink)
New User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 9
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by canadianjem View Post
I really don't think anyone said anything accusatory... Just a blanket statement made about breeders in general.
Think offence was taken where none was applied...just sayin'
I appreciate your opinion and I believe there is a place for this discussion and I respect and appreciate everyone's dedication to the breed and in sending people on the right path to a reputable breeder. I just don't think it's the place to have the conversation about backyard breeders, etc. under MY Kennel name. A conversation of this nature should be under another thread title and I don't think this is an unreasonable statement. It's the potential inferences made that bother me. I have said my piece about other statements made and I will not re-hash that again. Everyone has the right to their opinion, but some opinions/statements went too far and that's where private email comes in. It was my understanding that this forum was supposed to be a positive tool in helping individuals with their Boxers and helping them finding a reputable breeder. Not to bash breeders/kennels. I am not forum savvy, but the BT forums I am aware of prohibit the mentioning of any kennel name in a negative way, due to the legal ramifications involved. If one wants to talk about a breeder fine, but comments that may be seen as defamatory are to be limited to private email. But again, that's a different forum. Me personally, when I am asked about other breeders, etc. my approach is to give them a list of breeders I recommend, as opposed to saying "don't adopt from this person", etc. and get into negative statements. If I am really put on the spot, I personally say "no comment". But that's me. Just saying...
BedfordReg'd is offline  
Old 03-04-2013, 02:44 PM   #29 (permalink)
Advanced User
 
SaharaNight Boxers's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 907
Default Bedford Reg'd - advice on breeder

Quote:
Originally Posted by svince View Post
I have messaged the site moderator to remove the thread.
Personally, I think it should stay. If anyone else is wondering about this breeder it gives an answer and also has some good points. Closed yes, but not removed.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App
SaharaNight Boxers is offline  
Old 03-04-2013, 03:38 PM   #30 (permalink)
Super Moderator
 
Kaco Boxers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Kawartha Lakes, Ontario
Posts: 6,908
Default

Holy cow did this thread ever go in a different direction. I think things were taken out of context.

I will say that I personally know this breeder. As a potential puppy buyer you need to ask yourself what do you feel comfortable with and what don't you. Bedford, has only two boxers that have limited health testing but at least they have some. They researched their lines through multiple generations and have documentation showing the health results of those generations. They in home raise and take great care in placing their puppies.

I would rather purchase from this type of breeder that knows about their dogs and lines than someone who just throws to dogs together cause they look nice.

Some breeders do more testing, some do none and others do what they are concerned about.

In the end it comes down to going to the breeders home if possible, talking to them on the phone and looking at what information they have regarding their lines/health testing.

If you feel comfortable then move forward with that breeder. If not, than look elsewhere.
__________________
Kari ~ Keeper, servant and mommy to the following crew


**Proudly Raw fed since 2009**

www.kacoboxers.com
Kaco Boxers is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Closed Thread



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:54 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
PetGuide.com
Basset Hound Forum Doberman Forum Golden Retriever Forum Beagle Forum
Boxer Forum Dog Forum Pit Bull Forum Poodle Forum
Bulldog Forum Fish Forum Havanese Forum Maltese Forum
Cat Forum German Shepherd Forum Labradoodle Forum Yorkie Forum Hedgehog Forum
Chihuahua Forum Retriever Breeds Cichlid Forum Dart Frog Forum Mice Breeder Forum