Boxer Breed Dog Forums banner

1 - 20 of 52 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello,
I am new to this board, and am hoping I am in the right place. We are looking to add a boxer pup to our family and want to get a puppy from a reputable breeder. I have come across a few breeders, but don't really know who is "good" and who are the ones that are BYB in disguise.
I saw Landos boxers, and spoke with them (no visits yet) but am a little worried because they seem to breed and have lots of pups within a couple of months (different dogs though) and they also ship their boxers to whomever--is that normal for an ethical breeder to do that? Any advice/opinions are really appreciated. The owner sent me her contract-again, some of it seems great (heart/hip/temperament 3 yr guarantee) but some of it seems sketchy (if for any reason I cannot keep the pup, the breeder has "first right of refusal" for a discounted price). I am new to getting a pup from a breeders, so I don't know if this is common practice?

If anyone has got their pup/dog from Landos and has feedback that would be great. If anyone knows of another good-ethical breeder in Central Ontario (Prefer GTA/Simcoe areas) I would really appreciate the feedback.

Thank you so much for your help!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
82 Posts
I have one of Landos Boxers and he is a great dog.If you live near Woodstock you can come up and see him.Just call me at 519 462 2552
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
92 Posts
I know nothing about Landos boxers. My biggest concern would be that all health testing has been done. Giving a heart/hip guarantee for three years doesn't really mean much since since most boxers wont have those problems at that age. However you can begin to test for heart at 2 although some say it is too early, first right of refusal is something that is very standard in almost all breeders contracts as we do not want you to pass on our babies to just anyone and have them end up in shelters, rescues or in homes that will not properly care for them. I am not sure what you mean by discounted price, most breeders will exchange the puppy for a same quality puppy if you give the puppy back for health or temperment reasons but if you simply change your mind and not longer want the dog or can care for the dog typically the breeder would simply take the dog back with no money being refunded. This is my experience in the past. Shipping really depends on the breeder I know most breeders really would rather not ship a puppy across the country or just anywhere because onethey would want to be able to do a home visit and see where the puppy would be staying and second that is a lot of stress on a small puppy however I know for the right home many will make exceptions.
Having lots of litters is a little scary but it depends too is this a normal practise or do they simply happen to have more then one litter at this time. I think I would be concerned if this was the typical but again doesnt mean it is a BYB but may be a red flag. Are both parents Champions? I have never seen a BYB with both parents as Champions so that would be a good sign although many breeders will breed a mother who is not a Champion if she really compliments a nice Champion male. Becareful of breeders who make a big deal about having a Champion bloodlines and showing you 5 generation pedigrees to show it since most dogs enless they are from generation after generation of BYB will have Champions in their 3 year pedigree. I good breeder will have at least one and in most cases both parents who are Champions.
So again I would make sure all health testing has been done, 24 hour Holter, Thyroid, OFA and even possibly DNA test for DM and hips tested. I would say the forst three are manditory or I would not even look at the puppies.
Just my thoughts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,196 Posts
I am assuming this is the breeder out of Canada. If so, I would pass. I see nothing about health testing and to have so many dogs you can bet they are all in a kennel. A good breeder usually only has a couple of boxers that they breed and usually only breed once a year at most per boxer. They are almost always welped in the home, not stuck outside in a kennel. This sounds like a money making project. I'm not going to use the term "puppy mill" because I have not seen how or where they live. But, it does sounds like a definate overabundance of boxer breeding. I would definately run the other way and look elsewhere.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
Go onto the Northern Ontario Boxer Club and look at their member listings.... There are some wonderful ethical breeders who do health testing... While they might not be breeding themselves they might be able to direct you....

Northern Ontario Boxer Club
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
670 Posts
If you have ever talked to Linda- from landos boxers- on the phone you would know that her dogs are in home. If you are really lucky you will hear Argos antics!

I think a lot on here know my stance with Landos boxers so I will not dive into it. On another note... I am hoping to fly up to ON this summer and visit her kennel and I will be sure to post lots of info if I manager to get the time off to do so.

I have a Landos Boxer bitch and find her wonderful to train and work. If you are apprehensive about her health testing ask to see supporting documentation. Take what you read (opinions) with a grain of salt b/c there is usually some bitter history behind it.

Trust but verify.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,170 Posts
I'd say I agree with 2wildboxers. I looked at their site. A reputable breeder will yell from the rooftops about health testing. I see not one iota of ANY testing on their site, nor do I see a single pedigree. Once again, a good breeder will be PROUD of their dogs' pedigrees. When you click on a link to a certain dog, all there is is a picture. Okay, so there's a cute Boxer. What else? Just because a breeder has a quality website does not mean they have quality Boxers. Cannot stress enough the words HEALTH TESTING, HEALTH TESTING, HEALTH TESTING!!!! And also proof thereof.

Good luck.

And I DO NOT have any history with this breeder, let alone bitter history. It's a mere fact that if you have healthy dogs and they've been proven as such by testing, you're NOT going to omit that from your website.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
670 Posts
like I said if you have an issue with the information available on their website; take it to Linda via the on site contact information. She is more then happy to forward any information you require to you.

Obviously, one has not seen a forged pedigree copied and pasted from a website...
Go to the source for your information- hearsay has a way of being wrong.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
82 Posts
I'm with you Fraserbw. I've been to Lindas place and her dogs are treated with TLC.
I have a lot of repect for her and the knowledge she has about breeding boxers.I have one of her dogs which is 3 years old and never had any health problems. How
many so called reputable breeders offer 3 year guarantee on heart,hips and temperment.
Come on I want to see a list of the breeders that can make that claim.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,170 Posts
Hey I'm not saying anything about a guarantee, but I'll tell you what, a breeder who does health testing IS GOING TO ADVERTISE AS SUCH!!! I don't give a shit if she coddles her puppies or they have a good home. Really, I don't. I think it's also a crock she has fostering on there. Why? So she can produce as many pups as possible to make as much money as possible. So sorry to offend you. But dogs with champion lines and numerous numerous champion "get" have proven pedigrees. Hell, I don't even give a shit cuz I could go to the ABC and find my female's sire right there under SIRES OF MERIT! duh. The breeder I got my female from posts her pedigrees along with her health testing. No shit someone can copy and paste, but I can just call OFA or whoever did any other tests to verify it, can't I? And who cares about hips -- I'm talking DM. Do you even know what DM is? How about Holters. Damn, put a pic up there with your dog being holtered. Just show something that you give a shit about their health... I see nothing of the sort.

What's her reason for breeding besides just pure hobby/money?

AND I'll tell you another thing, I'd be putting the ages of my dogs on the site, my past dogs on the site, the ages which they died and of what. Proven longevity is not a guarantee, but it's as close to one as you can get!

And this comment:
"How many so called reputable breeders offer 3 year guarantee on heart,hips and temperment."
Come on I want to see a list of the breeders that can make that claim."

By far the stupidist comment I've seen yet on this forum.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Sandra, I hope you can ignore all the nastiness that is being thrown around on your thread. If you don't have a good gut-feeling about this breeder, then I wouldn't bother with them. Those who have had experience with the breeder have told you their experience, but it's also good to visit and ask for all documentation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
670 Posts
Hey I'm not saying anything about a guarantee, but I'll tell you what, a breeder who does health testing IS GOING TO ADVERTISE AS SUCH!!! I don't give a shit if she coddles her puppies or they have a good home. Really, I don't. I think it's also a crock she has fostering on there. Why? So she can produce as many pups as possible to make as much money as possible. So sorry to offend you. But dogs with champion lines and numerous numerous champion "get" have proven pedigrees. Hell, I don't even give a shit cuz I could go to the ABC and find my female's sire right there under SIRES OF MERIT! duh. The breeder I got my female from posts her pedigrees along with her health testing. No shit someone can copy and paste, but I can just call OFA or whoever did any other tests to verify it, can't I? And who cares about hips -- I'm talking DM. Do you even know what DM is? How about Holters. Damn, put a pic up there with your dog being holtered. Just show something that you give a shit about their health... I see nothing of the sort.

And this comment:
"How many so called reputable breeders offer 3 year guarantee on heart,hips and temperment."
Come on I want to see a list of the breeders that can make that claim."

By far the stupidist comment I've seen yet on this forum.
-----------------------------------
And this is by far one of the rudest post that I have seen on this site... You certainly bombed your temperament tests ;)

Do you even know the details of her foster program? Do you know that she pays major medical on these foster dogs? No because you are just another close minded snub! no questions just quick to judge on a preformed biased opinion based on a generalization of Other bad breeders and what other breeders have done. I think when that happens its called prejudice... are you a prejudice person? Should I assume that and therefore shoot down all your opinions? Come on get the facts...

As for DM:
a condition in older dogs that effects the spinal cord and results in a loss of coordination and paralysis of the hind legs... This is genetic and the gene can be tested for...

I had a german sheperd that suffered from this because of poor breeding which i got when i was 5 and aided my family in providing a quality life for the dog.

And while we are on the topic do you know that Hip dysplasia is? What about PRA? CRS? ARVC? Do you know what tests are required to certify breeding stock?

Have you ever seen a boxer or; for that matter, any dog suffer from these disorders?

Have you searched for or contacted any parties involved with studding these litters? i have and I have the OFA reports.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
-----------------------------------
And this is by far one of the rudest post that I have seen on this site... You certainly bombed your temperament tests ;)

Do you even know the details of her foster program? Do you know that she pays major medical on these foster dogs? No because you are just another close minded snub! no questions just quick to judge on a preformed biased opinion based on a generalization of Other bad breeders and what other breeders have done. I think when that happens its called prejudice... are you a prejudice person? Should I assume that and therefore shoot down all your opinions? Come on get the facts...

As for DM:
a condition in older dogs that effects the spinal cord and results in a loss of coordination and paralysis of the hind legs... This is genetic and the gene can be tested for...

I had a german sheperd that suffered from this because of poor breeding which i got when i was 5 and aided my family in providing a quality life for the dog.

And while we are on the topic do you know that Hip dysplasia is? What about PRA? CRS? ARVC? Do you know what tests are required to certify breeding stock?

Have you ever seen a boxer or; for that matter, any dog suffer from these disorders?

Have you searched for or contacted any parties involved with studding these litters? i have and I have the OFA reports.
:clap2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,170 Posts
I'm not a close-minded anything. I'm basing my OPINION on her website. Her website is LACKING. If, in fact, there is testing done by this breeder, she's causing others to judge her by the mere omission of such. To me, a site that is replete with junk, yet void of imperative information on testing, health of the dogs, pedigrees, etc., her REASON for breeding is waaaay out of the norm for a REPUTABLE breeder. Sorry, but I would move on, that's all. In MY mind, a site that doesn't mention one iota of health testing in her line obviously either doesn't see it as an important factor in anyone's mind when searching for a puppy or she just doesn't health test, period. And it shouldn't be left to the purchaser to guess that maybe the dogs are certified, she should at least provide information of such so that then you can verify it. Even a link to OFA of the dogs, but, of course, there's not one.

Yeah, and so glad you can google DM to get the definition... Yes, I know what tests ABC recommends for dogs in breeding programs. Do I NEED to know this? No. I'm not a breeder, but I've educated myself after getting burned before. Lack of knowledge and lack of education on what the standards are is what keeps BYBs in business.

And fostering should be paid for, but fostering, per se, is usually done when a dog NEEDS a home, like from the Humane Society or something, not preplanned fostering. Then their future is also planned by the mere fact it is to be bred to make more money off of pups... How could you NOT see that as wrong??? Most breeders only co-own to show or reproduce for show prospects, not glorified puppy-milling, because that is what one can infer since she mentions NO OTHER reason for her breeding. It's a front if I ever saw one, as I've never ever heard of such a thing.

Laws are now being passed about breeders and the maximum number of dogs they can own. This in MY opinion is just a way of getting around it by having others care for the dogs, yet benefiting from them. Do the foster "parents" get a "cut" of the money made from the pups??? Hmmm, I doubt it...

This is not even worth the effort of typing any longer... I'd rather look around to give or get NEEDED advice or help. All the OP was asking for was opinions; people looked at the site, gave opinions based on IT, THAT'S ALL!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Are you kidding? You know, I'm not the ONLY one on this thread that said to move on...

Glorified puppy-milling.
It wasn't the point of saying move on. If you read my first post, you'd see that I said to move on as well if they feel uncomfortable with the situation.

Your post was more than rude, and clearly I'm not the only who thought so. I agree on the fact that any and all responsible breeders would be proud to show off all documentation, but you don't have any experience with this breeder, and it could be on an asked for basis.

"Our breeding program includes only the very best of the German Bloodlines. German bloodlines whose dogs have proven themselves through stringent German testing. Only those boxers who pass the endurance, conformation, and workability and health tests can be part of a German breeding program."

Did you read the site at all? They are making a claim that their dogs are infact health tested, and I don't know about you, but I'd think that if they are making this claim on a public domain, they probably have some sort of documents to back it up. Maybe they don't have a copy on the website, but perhaps they would be more than happy to email/fax/mail a copy of anything you ask for. If you're so doubtful, why not even contact the breeder yourself and gain some insight?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
670 Posts
Close minded - unwilling to accept others opinion. Argumentative when their opinion is challenged.... Maybe you should google that...

As I have said if you read the post... I have had a DM German Shepard. I have carried one up and down stairs and watched him cry/whine as he slowly lost control of his bladder during the last month of his life. We tried the DVM treatments we suffered the reality with him... don't you dare claim that I googled to find out what DM is.

Get over yourself and let YOUR point go and let others give their opinion. Personally I have heard enough of your opinion. Why don't you find some PetMart/Petsmart Boxer owners and haggle them for a while. There are plenty of them on here ;)

At least this individual would know where their boxers is from...
H
eck, here is a better idea... we could use google to compile a listing listing of breeders sites we can find so that you may pick them apart... we could point out how they could make them better and what information they are missing... hey they must all be missing something... Maybe some feed Raw... There must be an issue with that... Think of the sanitation issues... Not to mention the potential of puncturing bowls... Maybe with your help we can get them all up on animal cruelty charges. Darn... I just found on it TX... I didn't see central air or an air unit... Don't they know boxers are sensitive to extrema climates... its also missing information on pest control... Don't they know there are poisons snakes in TX? oh there is a chocolate lab in that picture... maybe they actually selling mix breeds... oh well at least they can now compete in AKC obedience trails so its not a complete loss... Oh this one has someone smoking in the background... I'm not sure if there is canibis in there... should I call the local PD to find out?

{point here being that you can always find something you do not like if you look hard enough. but yes I would have issue with the foster program if it was NOT clearly posted as part of her program.}
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,170 Posts
It wasn't the point of saying move on. If you read my first post, you'd see that I said to move on as well if they feel uncomfortable with the situation.


"Our breeding program includes only the very best of the German Bloodlines. German bloodlines whose dogs have proven themselves through stringent German testing. Only those boxers who pass the endurance, conformation, and workability and health tests can be part of a German breeding program."

Did you read the site at all? They are making a claim that their dogs are infact health tested, and I don't know about you, but I'd think that if they are making this claim on a public domain, they probably have some sort of documents to back it up. Maybe they don't have a copy on the website, but perhaps they would be more than happy to email/fax/mail a copy of anything you ask for. If you're so doubtful, why not even contact the breeder yourself and gain some insight?
I think you need to look at my first post -- was NOT rude at all. I just said a breeder who health tests will say it. I said there's not a mention of health testing nor a pedigree. That's it!! I was attacked by merely stating my opinion and stating that I had never seen a forged pedigree.

And, YES, I looked at the site. You omitted essential wording to your quote. The rest of the paragraph read:

"Lando's Registered Kennels has started with these outstanding dogs to produce an extraordinary line of beautiful, strong, working boxers. A boxer with the brains and the brawn for the job; a boxer who will be a treasured part of the family."

STARTED with these dogs -- what, 15 years ago??? I am not bashing this breeder by ANY means, it's just an INCOMPLETE website or complete, based on what is actually done. And are you kidding, anyone can make ANY claim on ANY website. It's in the hands of the purchaser on whether to follow up with the claims.

Yeah, my dogs evolved from Germany too! DUH! Didn't they all?

But my female's sire is SOM. My male's sire is Ch & Grandsire SOM; hence a REASON for both of them being bred!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,030 Posts
I am assuming this is the breeder out of Canada. If so, I would pass. I see nothing about health testing and to have so many dogs you can bet they are all in a kennel. A good breeder usually only has a couple of boxers that they breed and usually only breed once a year at most per boxer. They are almost always welped in the home, not stuck outside in a kennel. This sounds like a money making project. I'm not going to use the term "puppy mill" because I have not seen how or where they live. But, it does sounds like a definate overabundance of boxer breeding. I would definately run the other way and look elsewhere.
Why would you pass if the breeder is out of Canada? Is that because you do not see any health testing or because you would in general not buy from a Canadian breeder?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,030 Posts
I'd say I agree with 2wildboxers. I looked at their site. A reputable breeder will yell from the rooftops about health testing. I see not one iota of ANY testing on their site, nor do I see a single pedigree. Once again, a good breeder will be PROUD of their dogs' pedigrees. When you click on a link to a certain dog, all there is is a picture. Okay, so there's a cute Boxer. What else? Just because a breeder has a quality website does not mean they have quality Boxers. Cannot stress enough the words HEALTH TESTING, HEALTH TESTING, HEALTH TESTING!!!! And also proof thereof.

Good luck.

And I DO NOT have any history with this breeder, let alone bitter history. It's a mere fact that if you have healthy dogs and they've been proven as such by testing, you're NOT going to omit that from your website.

If a breeder is claiming it is health testing, what would be your next step?
 
1 - 20 of 52 Posts
Top