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A real dog trainer will never use an e collar. They make for a nervous dog as they never know when they will be shocked to me they should be outlawed! A collar that vibrates is another thing altogether and can be used to get a dogs attention. Your dog should obey your command because it WANTS to not because it FEARS you. I can pick a shock collar dog out in a heart beat they are the ones visibly anxious and a generally a nervous wreck.
 

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It depends on the dog. Mine is deaf.

I use one that has both vibrate and shock. I only use the shock when she is going after a skunk or doing something that may hurt her.
She has been trained that when it vibrates she is to look at me or come to me so I can give her the command I want
 

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I think the exception here is your case. There is a supposed “off leash” trainer in our area that charges people a lot of money to “train” thier dogs I have seen the end result of this in 4 dogs of various breeds, two of them Goldens that were a nervous wreck and attacked my friends Boxer another a GSD the guys was bragging about the dog was again so nervous he just couldn’t settle down and another mixed breed dog not bonded to her owner at all but would watch her constantly waiting for that zap it makes me sick
 

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I can totally understand why that would be sickaning to see.
I totally believe that it's not the devices that are the problem, it's the people using them or better words abusing them.
No different then phones, computers etc etc

in a hearing dog the shock should NEVER be used. In my case it is ONLY used when she is to far away from me for me to get her in an emergency situation. Other than that I only use the vibrate.

At home she only has her collar on at night when I take her out to the bathroom and she doesn't leave our property without it on
 

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I did read the first E-Collar artical someone posted? And it was full off so much "Old School "Crap and think." That I could not deal with it. Nothing but "Old School Think," said by people that have no idea what they are taking about?

And before I go on, I want to make it "Clear," that I am not talking about "Gypsy'sMom!" Taking on a "Deaf Dog?" Is commendable! Thuat is not a challenge I would want to take take on! So big props for that! :)

So I will just will deal with the "Standard Crap," that people believe. And number one would be E-Collar are used by people that don't what they are doing? Well yeah that is "mostly true/' But if you follow people that do know what they are doing? They will say ... Larry Khron (for one) if you can't train Pro a a dog without an E-Collar? Then you can't train a dog with an E-Collar!

One of my buddies on Germanshepard.com was "Lou Castle," former K9 Trainer and Dog Guy. And he say's the "fastest most humane, way to train a dog, is with the "PROPER USE OF AN E-COLLAR," And "Larry Khron," my favorite trainer says ... "if you can't train a dog without an E-Collar? Then you can't train a dog with an E-Collar!"

I don't use a E-Collar myself, cuz I am more pig headed, then my dog! But my Bella fit's the classic definition of a dog that should be E-Collar Trained. A dog that know's and understands the given command ... and chooses ... not to obey!

Yeah that is her .. still! "Pro's" use the E-Collar to sharpen and shape a dog's response to a given command! That is a thing and these day's, pretty much everyone that knows what they are doing, uses an E-Collar.

But if one reads an E-Collar artcials it should say ... it takes "Two Weeks'" first to get the dog to use the E-collar on his neck. You don't use the remote at all and from there ... and after that you would find the dog's "Working Level!" If you don't see that? Then any E-Collar article is full of crap!

And a "nervous, skittish GSD, that won't settle down ... LOL. But the day's of the "Rin Tin Tin," dogs are long gone! One had best have there "Crap Together," for one of those guy's. :)

Great dog's but yeah ...
 

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Thank you for all the kind words,

I know I must have come off sounding defensive and I didn't mean too. I'm just so tired of people being looped into categories these days without any back ground and the same goes for dogs as well.

Any animal can become bad or aggressive if they have bad owners and bad owners can create bad dogs, skittish and timid dogs regardless of the devices they use
 

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Thank you for all the kind words,

I know I must have come off sounding defensive and I didn't mean too. I'm just so tired of people being looped into categories these days without any back ground and the same goes for dogs as well.

Any animal can become bad or aggressive if they have bad owners and bad owners can create bad dogs, skittish and timid dogs regardless of the devices they use
Oh it's not you and your response was fine.

And you get big prop's anyway for taking on a "Deaf Dog!" If you want such a dog, to ever be able to just run free? You'd have no choice?

I did not read this "article?" But I did read another ... that was full of so much "Old School Think," that I could not deal with it. "Lou Castle," ojne of my "Friends on Germansheaprdforum," before we uh both got "Banned!" Said the "Fastest and most Humane way to your dog," is with the proper use of an E-Collar!

He's a Pro Trainer and ex K9 Handler ... and we both had issue with today's LE K9's, another story. And this is his article on "Crittering."

And "Larry khron," has an E-Collar book on Amazon. And he say's if you can't train a "Dog w/o and E-Collar?" Then you should not be training a Dog with one ... uh he was not talking about you dog, he was talking about most dog's my current Bella! Special case and she falls here,:

A dog that knows and understands the Command and choses' not to obey!? She is "Pig Headed," and so am I ... so we go round and round? But under the right conditions which are easy to find for me. She gets' to run off leash pretty much all the time. But if you don't give her a "Command First," she won't comply ... apprently?

Boxer/Pit and I am waiting for her to do the "Right Thing," like my Boxer and my GSD ... because she "knows!" It's been year's and so far .... that is not happening?

Anyway your good. :)
 

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E-collar is just a tool. If you know how to use one they are great. If you don't know how, you can really screw up a dog. E-collar is not made for "shocking" your dog when used correctly. If you are shocking your dog to the point of the dog yelping or in distress, stop using it, because you have no clue what you are doing.
 
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