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We’ve got a six-year-old female, Nollie & about eight months ago we added an 8 week old male puppy - Pumbaa. Both dogs have been fixed. So the little guy is now 10 months old, over the last few weeks they have gotten into five pretty bad fights, they’ve pretty much escalated and gotten worse every time with the last one resulting in stitches for Nollie. It’s really weird because they had a really great bond and have been best friends for the last six months. Around the same time with the fights started it was discovered that she had a cyst or actually turned out to be a non-cancerous tumor on her leg down near her paw. We ended up having that removed about 10 days ago so she is recovering. We’ve been keeping the dogs separate for eating and sleeping and actually most of the day. We’ve gotten them together here & there very carefully and there had been no issues until today. The little guy licked her on the face, kind of gave her a kiss and then laid down next to her, as soon as he laid down she tried to attack him again. We were able to pull them apart without any damage. How do we get back to where we were? The vet is telling us we’re doing something wrong and is suggesting a trainer and giving Nollie fairly heavy doses of sedatives, which she says are going to be long term. The female has never really liked other dogs but it sure seems like something is especially off with her right now, you can see it in her face, She really doesn’t want me to pet her shit and she wants to be on her own, regularly leaves the rest of the family and lays down in another room by herself which she never really did before. I don’t want to get rid of either of these dogs, I don’t know what to do but I know I don’t have money for tons more medication and dog training. Any ideas?
 

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First pic was right when we brought him home, this one is about two months ago. They love traveling and camping together. Hopefully we can get to this point again
 

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Oh crap! Well serious issue's seem to be showing up a bit sooner ... then I expected?? But whatever, "Got Your Back!" And I am just gonna "glaze over the fact that with a Boy and a Girl?? You should not be seeing this kinda crap?? So it's nothing you did wrong?? But inasmuch as "now," you know ... I can tell you that the "Girl's," can be "Bitches!" :)

For some back ground on that ... see here.:

It's not directly related to what your doing with cuz pretty much everyone would say "Boy and Girl," combos should work out fine. But sometimes "Crap Happens??"

Drug's for the most part aren't really a solution anyway and "Trainer's," unless you know where to look are a Waste of money. Cuz the ones that can deal "successfully" with Dog Aggression, are kinda pricey!

But hey ... it's your luck day! Although, I was a "Fail," with "Pack Aggression," cuz you know, my Band Dawg passed due to unrelated issues (after five Pack Fight's and I got stitches!) I got a second chance to solve successfully, my Oversized Working Line GSDs , Human Aggression Issues! No Trainer required.

it worked out great, and no trainer required. But ... as it turns out I am not a "Dog Trainer??" I am more of a "behaviourist," it would seem??? As if I have dog that has, no serious "Behavioural Issues?? I do seem to be a bit lost. Sigh ... Bella!

And I would say making life go back to what it was it before?? May not be doable?? But making them be civil with each certainly can be done! f that is "Good Enough??" We can help! If it is not?? It would be best to rehome the new guy. Find a Boxer Rescue and offer to "Foster In Place." That's a pretty choice "we," know but unless your willing to make a most likely a lot of changes with how you live with these dog's day in day out there seem's to be where you are??

It's your call, Welcome Aboard in anycase and sorry it's a pretty bumpy ride so far. :(
 

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Welcome aboard times 2!
I don't have any advice cause I've only had one Boxer, but man that totally sucks!?! Hope you can get something figured out. They are beautiful!
Rick
 

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Seems to me Nollie may still have something going on medically that just hasn't been identified as of yet. Maybe she just doesn't feel well and doesn't want to be bothered. I'm not sure you can get it back to where it was but if you do it will likely take time. Personally when the two dogs are in the same room for now I would keep them tethered apart, perhaps your wife holding one leash and you the other. Take them for walks and the two of you walk parallel together, your wife with one you with the other. One of you would be in-between in the early walk till you can see how they do side by side. I'd also maybe go to an empty parking lot and practice training, good heels, sits, walking in circles, down stays, etc. You would have plenty space to keep them apart as you work on getting them closer. Sometimes younger dogs re just too much for the older ones and thats it. Also teaching them both to stay on their mat is a good one, each has their own space. For now I would just keep them separated. Perhaps give the vets medication a try in the beginning to help ease her anxiety and to help you transition to this new way. (temporary) My boxer passed awhile back and he was the gentlest dog ever, I also hv a standard poodle who is the wild bouncy boy. My boxer and he were never egressive to one another but I always supervised and I knew when our boxer was tired and didn't want to play anymore and then I would take the poodle away to his area of the house. I hope it works out.
 

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Just another opinion but you said the female is avoiding contact with you maybe she is feeling put out not loved and the male is getting all the attention? Maybe she could have some arthritis issues? Is the male bothering her a lot being obnoxious with her? Its really not usual for the male/female thing to be a problem the male you have now is about at sexual maturity he could be challenging her in a way you don't recognize. You do have to be the alpha in the house they cannot think either of them is in charge. How much exercise do they get? I do not believe in drugs they can actually lower the dogs bite threshold causing more problems unless you want a zombie dog I don't think that's the answer. Maybe take the females alone out for walks spend some quality time with her let her know she is still important and loved she may think you are angry with her. If you could find some training help or look up some videos online maybe but be careful there is a lot of bad advice out there.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I appreciate all of your advice. To answer a few questions, with Nollie healing she currently is not getting much exercise but both of these dogs worked a minimum of 1.5 miles every morning. Most of those mornings include playing ball at the park, they definitely get tons of exercise. We have always been very careful to give her tons of attention and affection so that she didn’t feel the puppy was getting favoritism. I do believe I have a pack alpha hierarchy situation. She has always been an alpha female, boss dog type. The little guy, not so little anymore he towers over her and is much stronger and he is not backing down when she is trying to show her dominance. we love these dogs so much and I don’t know that we can get rid of the one of them.....How do you decide which one if that’s the decision you come to? I know Nollie was here 1st be she’s the aggressor . With it being 8 months now we’ve obviously become quite attached to the little guy, he has been in our home for eight months and now all the sudden he’s being attacked so he hast to leave? I’m having a hard time with this decision
 

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Definitely sounds like some problems going on. A couple quick questions.
Do you crate either dog?
Have you had the vet do blood work on the female to make sure there's not something else going on?
Have you done any training (puppy classes, general obedience, etc)?

As to the "how do you decide" question..
It's a easy but uncomfortable answer. You keep the dog that's the hardest to rehome. In this case it sounds like the female.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
The older dog was crate trained for the first year until she didn’t need to be anymore, the little guy is crate trained also. Has no problem going in there, sometimes he goes in there for naps with the door open. We did have the vet do bloodwork and the lab is doing a biopsy on the tumor that was moved. Still waiting on the results. The vet is saying that pulmonary results show nothing wrong, my wife swears that something is off with her. When we go to pet her she will pin her ears back and just look uncomfortable.
And yes both dogs had puppy training. Both actually listen very well, will sit & stay before eating, the puppy acts perfect on walks, stops at street crossings With just verbal commands, when he sees other dogs he minds well, the older dog although listens well at home does not on walks, if we come across another dog she pretty much flips out every time she sees another dog.
 

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Ok, so the fighting is a concern but the way she's acting around y'all is a bit more concerning.
For one, I would definitely get a full blood work up.
Just as a test, for a couple days/week, I would crate the male for a hour or so very day and give the female time alone with y'all and see if she continues to act the same. If she is still distance and a bit "off", it could be a sign of something medical. If she starters to revert back to her old self when he is up... well then it's most likely a training issue you'll have to address.
Does that make sense?
 

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The older dog was crate trained for the first year until she didn’t need to be anymore, the little guy is crate trained also. Has no problem going in there, sometimes he goes in there for naps with the door open. We did have the vet do bloodwork and the lab is doing a biopsy on the tumor that was moved. Still waiting on the results. The vet is saying that pulmonary results show nothing wrong, my wife swears that something is off with her. When we go to pet her she will pin her ears back and just look uncomfortable.
Hmm it maybe time to seek a second opinion depending on the pending result's. Cuz just as a general rule ... women seem to be better act recognizing "some change's," then guy's are (speaking for myself at any rate.) :)


the older dog although listens well at home does not on walks, if we come across another dog she pretty much flips out every time she sees another dog.
Ok, that is certainly not all of your current issue's (assuming no medical condition) but it is certainly a part of it! If she exhibit's that type of behaviour when out and about?? It is easily something she cab bring back home.

Is "that behaviour," a recent change or has she been doing that for 6 year's???
 

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Backing up a little bit here. Back to which one would have to go?? And I suppose speaking for myself,
when I take in a dog, it's basically ... "Till Death do us part." Either there's or mine. I don't "Leash," my dog's and "dump," them year's later if "I," decide to get another dog and it's not working out??

It would be my choice to get another dog and if I screwed up ... my first dog should not lose there "home," because "I" made a mistake??? If I could not make it work (if I had issue's??) There would be no question that my "Experimental Dog??" Would be the one to go. My firs dog would never have to fear that one day they could lose there happy home, cuz I made a mistake??

And rehoming a dog with (Leash Reactivity) is a big ask anyway. Not a lot of would be owner's out there saying ..."Yeah Boy," sigh me up??? And yes, there are of course some, but the pool for taking in a "Dog," with issue's is pretty small??

Not saying it would be easy to give up the new guy of course. But if worst comes to worst, it would be "The Right Thing To Do." Hoping it won't come to that ... of course.
 

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Hmm it maybe time to seek a second opinion depending on the pending result's. Cuz just as a general rule ... women seem to be better act recognizing "some change's," then guy's are (speaking for myself at any rate.) :)


Ok, that is certainly not all of your current issue's (assuming no medical condition) but it is certainly a part of it! If she exhibit's that type of behaviour when out and about?? It is easily something she cab bring back home.

Is "that behaviour," a recent change or has she been doing that for 6 year's???
Her behavior out on walks has been like that her whole life. She’s kind of a bitch
 

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Her behavior out on walks has been like that her whole life. She’s kind of a bitch
LOL ... well yeah. :)

I've met a lot of Boxer's over the year's (nowhere near as many as BTE2 of course) and worked with a few. Usually problem Walker's. Deer Chaser's and Fear of People, were high light's.

But in all the Boxer's I have met on both coast. There was only one that stood out as a dog you would not want to meet on an outing with your dog! And that was a girl!??

Some neighbor's were out while I was walking Rocky and we stopped to chat ... they had a fully fenced in front yard about four feet. Kinda unusual around here, but whatever.

We chat and Rocky of course ignored them and there other little yappy dog. And they say we have a Boxer also. So of course, I say "can I see her??" No meet and greet cuz I don't that with my dog's and they would have uh No anyway. But I just wanted to see her. And they said sure but she has other dog "issue's."But yeah you can see her. And with that they brought her out. So with them safely behind the fence and straining at the leash, they brought her out. And they stayed about five feet away so I could see her. She was a beautiful Flashy Boxer and also the scariest Boxer I have ever seen!!

The most remarkable part, even though she did not make a sound?? She stared at Rocky like he was "Raw Meat," and never relaxed and never moved! Most likely Rocky out weighted her by at least 45 lbs??
But she seemed not to care?? I was stunned and a little spooked. I thanked them for there time and we got the heck out of there!!

Now that is not the "norm," of course. And by and large most or at least a lot of Female Boxer, owner's can never conceive of there "Baby Girl." Just losing it??

I manged to trip that switch in my Struddell, over Baby Kitten's being born and Gunther's "lack of RESPECT!" He barked at each new birth, exciting stuff right here! But Stru was getting ticked off! And if Daddy was not gonna stop him them by God she would!! I just told that story most likely in the Female v Female thread.

At any rate, it was epic! And even though I am a veteran, sigh of "house mate's gone wrong??" 85 lbs of American Bandogge vs 113 lb's of WL GSD. Five freaking time's ... still the guy's uh even with the trip to the ER for stitches in my hand breaking up one fight!

The guy's were nothing compared to the sheer ferocity my Baby Girl put on! She was just insane???!! But that was my bad. I misread the situation?? I should not have had Gunther in the room with the kitten's being born?? Live and learn. :)

But way back in the day before I got my first Boxer, I read a book on Boxer's and as regard's Boy vs Girl. All it said was ... the girl's are different?? So yeah that is suitably vague???. Even still I prefer the girl's myself. But if asked for a "Boxer," recommendation, I would say ... get a Boy and keep life simple.

Now that has not worked for you (so far) but it seem's like something my be up with your girl?? So certainly no more sleeping together for the dog's. And I would doubt down on the Crate advise and start Crating both.

There's not much that can be done for now. Until you figure out if "something" is indeed wrong with her ... sorry. :(
 

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Ok so just so you know. I'm not giving up! As a big part of what to do, comes from a better understanding of what went wrong???

And in the beginning when I had ... "dog's gone wrong??" I made all the "usual mistakes!" Of course at the time ... I did not know, what was going wrong or what to do about it?? Figuring crap out on your on?? Can be both "Expensive," and uh painful!" And at the time, when I was dealing with Human Aggression with my (first) WL GSD ... there was "No One," online that had anything useful to say in the way of advise ... you know aside from "Find a Trainer." And "trainer's on dog forum's are few and far between! On a "Dog Forum," everybody is a expert! :)

But there are a "few," and the couple of things, I learned from one of them on "Germanshepardforum," I share ... all the time! Cuz you know if you want to see "owner's," dealing with serious crap ... all the freaking time ... go there! In the top three of most popular Breed in America all the time "anyway," go figure??

And for the record ... "I am not an expert!" Just to be "crystal clear!" So what I learned ... I figured out thru the school of hard knocks! Not really the best way to figure crap out?? But hey it worked for me! :)

So you know, online ... I'm pretty much the resident squealer???

Moving on ... the best way to fix issues?? Is by having a better understanding of what went wrong??? So it's, you know best ... to learn from other's! Rather than you know, making the same old "mistake's" all over again.

Now these day's Larry seems to be, E-Collar training?? He has a book that I have and uh judging by my Bella, I have not used or finished reading! So yeah "apparently," I'm still "pig headed and stubborn! I did not need one to "Fix," my Wl GSD's Human Aggression Issue's so why should I need one to fix Bella's pigged headed and lazy lack of recall??? Aww well the "Real World," as it and you know people do stuff. :)

Nonetheless ... learn from other's so you first need to have some Idea of what you did wrong?? And this clip may be useful??


So you are not alone in dealing with difficult dog situations. Cuz "Crap Happens!" It's what you do about it ... that can make a difference. :)
 

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I would likely follow what bte said and if you must regime one I'd say as much as it hurts, it would be the younger male. He would be pretty easy to regime, the senior dogs tend to sit and since she is a leash reactive dog it is likely she would be very difficult to place. Beside I don't think you could do that to a family member you've had for 6 years. I still feel there is something medical going on.
 

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The first two boxers I had I made a mistake and got a male pup when my female was 10 looking back that wasn't a good idea, she never liked the male would not play with him she was an alpha type female really quite a rhymes with witch but had mellowed out as she got older she never accepted him as a friend but they did learn to get along there was no fighting she would snap at him some times. You maybe have to keep them separated I am still feeling like this is some kind of jealousy thing maybe have only one out at a time have play time and walking separate if you can find a way to work this maybe you won't have to rehome one of them like other posters have said I don't think the female is going to rehome well. Is the male annoying her like does he persist when she growls at him? Is he trying to mount her standing over her wagging his tail and sniffing her face? Those are dog signals he is trying to dominate her and she is not having it when you see him doing that stop him immediately what looks like friendliness to humans is something else to dogs and her being an alpha type she wont tolerate it. I wish you luck with this a trainer may be able to help you understand what's going on here its not usual for male/female fights. That being said you don't like all the people you meet our dogs are the same ever have that sibling you just can't stand?
 

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Hmm, just a quick note on the clip I posted from Larry. A shot across the bow as if were. Please do not use an E-Collar ... for "this!" Larry was working with a client there and he was telling her how to proceed. I just wanted to be clear on that point. :)

I was trying to explain "why," Sit/Down/Come/Recall, Walks Well On leash and you can add Staying On The Front Lawn without supervision (no fence needed), Car Proofing and No Door bolting won't fix "behavioral issues??"

Your not the first that "assumes," it should?? My Rocky (GSD) knew all that stuff but none of that stopped him from,: Going After his Band Doggeband (House mate) and after that ... he decided "you know what?? I don't much care for people either!!" WTH ... clearly I had missed "something??"

Not to say that all that "stuff," is not important ...but sometimes, with some dog's ...it's still not enough??? Got more for another try at explaining (part) of what went wrong?? Assuming nothing medical of course. :)
 

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Hmmm, any update's here??? Are you keeping from having "issue's??" I got more to say. But you know I am extremely ... anal?? And I tend to think "owner's" can't fix "issues," without a lot of back ground on ... "what went wrong?? And what to do about it?? And explaining stuff tends to take a lot of word's.

It took me "literally year's," to understand how I "fixed," my WL GSD's, Human Aggression "issue???" Seemingly with out effort??? In his 10 year's of life ... sigh, he never got a single correction for any towards aggression to a single Human Being! And a lot of what I did is applicable to Dog on Dog! I tend to believe, that you can't no where you are going if you don't know where you've been?? :)

Or you know if you have to decided to keep both?? And learning is to much, pay for a "Trainer," after all?? And look for a "Balanced trainer." But so you know ... they will tell you, at least a lot of the same thing's thing I would tell you. :)
 
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