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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys,

Nice to meet you all. I really need help and I am totally open to suggestions. I have a 6-year-old 80-pound boxer female, Junebug, which I rescued 3 years ago. I love her so much! She is the perfect dog for me in every way, except one. She attacks my 8-year-old/4 pound female Pomeranian, Rainey. She has attacked her at least three times, twice in the last week. Seems worse since we had a mouse move in about a week or two back. The last time required a trip to the vet. Encounters with other dogs are infrequent and minor.

For a little history... I already had 5 dogs when Junebug came into our pack. (Australian Shepard(Male) she fought with frequently until rehomed, Malamute/Husky Mix(Female) she fights with occasionally, Border Collie/Husky Mix(Female) she fights with occasionally, Beagle/Spitz Mix(Female) she fought with occasionally until rehomed, and Pomeranian(Female) she has attacked a few times recently, and a Rat Terrier/Chuaua Mix(Male) never a problem with this dog. He is only 1 year old and joined after Junebug. All other dogs are at least 2 years older than Junebug). All of these dogs were rescued as puppies except the Australian and the Malamute/Husky Mix. All but the Pom and Rat have been rehomed with my two children who live on my land, but in different houses, and she only sees occasionally. No real issues with the Malamute/Husky and Border Collie Mix since rehomed. Junebug and the Pom are the only full-timers in our house. The Rat stays with us all day while my daughter works.

Junebug is my first boxer, but far from my first dog. I have many successful dog parenting experiences. Junebug was literally 'in the car on her way to the vet to be euthanized' when I made the decision to rescue her from a lady on FaceBook. She was 3 years old when I got her. She is AKC registered, and she is an amazing dog in every way, except as I mentioned before. Awesome on a leash. Awesome in the car/truck. Well behaved. I want so much to help her, but I've never dealt with an aggressive dog before.

I have read several threads on this forum already tonight and identified a few things that I need to change immediately! I've also learned a few things that I'm doing right. Up until tonight, we let her sleep in our bed with us. We let her lay on the couch, and I occasionally let her climb up in my lap. I now understand that is all wrong. I'm also not the authoritarian type of dog owner either. I correct her with a calm firm voice. I do not yell, or strike her, ever. I lovingly praise her when she does 'right'.

So, I think I have learned here tonight that I need to immediately stop allowing her to sleep in our bed and get up on the furniture. I need to 'treat' her and feed her, last. I normally give both dogs only one treat per day, after the last walk of the night, and give them to each dog at the same time. I have 3 acres of land that she and I walk the perimeter of at least a couple of times every day. What else have a missed? If I correct the issues that I've identified, do you guys think there is hope that I can help correct her aggression? Any suggestions on how to trust again? How can I ensure that my Pom is safe while Junebug and I learn correct behavior?

Please let me thank you all for taking the time to read my post and offer suggestions. I will return here tomorrow, and each day, to check for updates. No 'drive-by' posting from me. Thank you, folks.
 

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Welcome to the forum and its great you rescued your boxer. I'm not a trainer but will give you pointers. You also can google Jeff Gellman, he has lots of videos and has had free Skype sessions this past year to help with such matters.
Solid K9 Training, Perhaps you can reach out to him also. Boxer females seem to have issues with other females and they many times will not get along. I don't know why but there are exceptions. Meanwhile I would keep them apart, section off a part of the house and keep them away from on another. Again welcome and you will soon get lots of advise I am sure.
 

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Hmm, I trust your not gonna be a one post and out of here member. (Hmm ... OK I see you caught that!) I must say a title of this length, is most impressive! And as I am want to say, "I've never seen that before? :)

Not much point in harping on the female Boxers thing as you already know why two female with a Boxer being one is not a particularly good idea?? Still "crap happens" and it is what it is, so moving on.

It does seem like you now have some idea of what is going on with the bed and furniture thing. But to harp on that one just a little bit, the only dogs that should have bed, free roaming or furniture privileges, are dogs without serious behavioral issues. That said, your going to need to start over with this dog and step one is going to be "Crate Training" this dog. If she went away to a competent, qualified trainer at a Board and Train, she would be "Crate Trained," nuff said.

And starting over ... would look like the first link in here.:
German Shepherd Dog Forums - View Single Post - New Dog, Very Challenging

Moving on, by and large everyone that struggles with fighting pack members, always makes the same simple mistake. The new dog, like there other dog is allowed to "Free Roam" in the house! Been there done that got the stichies (breaking up pack fights!)

Between my Over Size WL GSD and my American Band Dawg! Five times as a matter of fact and Rocky (GSD) always started them! And every time it happened it was because "Rocky " was allowed to "Free Roam" indoors. You can't control a dog indoors if you don't know where they are or what they are doing???? So the free roaming indoors, policy needs to change. "Assuming" of course the problem dog is "Free Roaming???" If she, is then that needs to change, keep a drag leash on her indoors a short leash with no handle to get caught up on furniture. Indoors is to chill outside is for play.

You'll also need to train "The Place Command" that is how you will be able to have her indoors uncrated and still under "control." That will take some time but if you want to go beyond a a simple Crate and Rotate policy (which should be started) now, that's what it's gonna take but that's another topic (having her out of the crate indoors and having the other dog be safe.)

And the walk thing ... is "extremely important!" And I'm pretty sure you've got it "twisted???" I doubt you are walking her on these three acre excursions on leash??? If so you are conflating "exercise" with a "proper structured walk."

Yet again a mistake I also made! I have tons of access to open desert so you know, why bother "walking my dog???" Long story short but a huge part of my eventual success with my problem child/dog. Happened when I was finally forced to "Walk him" to find people to ignore (strangers was his other issue??) Worked out fine ... but that's another story also. But what I found is told by Larry Khron here.:


Sometimes ... "less is more."

And to cap off, here you go. Lot's of info here.
German Shepherd Dog Forums - View Single Post - My 11 month old GS is crazy!

And I know it seems like a lot?? And yeah most likely it is??? But it's all about gaining control and not really about "corrections" per se. The goal is to "prevent" your child/dog from making "poor choices" in the first place. t's all stuff a committed owner can accomplish, it just seems like a lot cause it's all in one place. :)

So ask questions and welcome aboard, sorry it's a bumpy ride so far. :(
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Wow! Thank you guys for your responses! I sincerely appreciate you. I will go over and digest the information. I will be back, with more questions, no doubt. Thank you again.
 

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Well, I dug through all of the information that you guys provided and digested it. I took a long look at myself as a pet owner, and recognized that I needed a lot of work.

No more laying on the couch.
No more sharing my ‘people food’.
No more sitting in my lap while watching TV.
No more free range in the house.
No more sleeping with me in my bed.
No more allowing her to decide when she gets attention and demanding it.
No more begging for food.
Longer and more frequent walks.

The one thing I was doing right was always using a leash when we walked and tried to keep it ‘structured’. She is pretty good on leash. She will pull a little in the beginning, but quickly realizes that I won’t tolerate it and settles down. She likes to keep tension on the leash, doesn’t generally pull too hard. I have experienced that her prey drive appears to be strong. If we jump a critter while walking she will make a strong effort to go after it. She has adapted well to being limited to a location. She is doing really well staying on, or near to, her pillow bed. All in all she seems to be much happier.

Now I am having another ‘leader’ issue. How do I regain my trust in her? How do I regain trust in her with the little Pom? We have been keeping them completely separated. Will I ever be able to trust allowing them to be together again? Would it be in everyone’s best interest to rehome my girl? I love my dog so much. The last thing I want to do is let her go. However, I also want to be a responsible pet owner. I want to help my girl succeed, not set her up to fail. Advice and opinions are very welcome.
 

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You will just need time. I wouldn't rehome her but I think I would just keep them separated. When one has some free roaming in the house then the other should be safely behind a gate. I actually do this with my little one even though my boxer doesn't look to attack him. I have a chihuahua who is quite old and pretty fragile so he mostly stays in my bedroom and when he comes out the boxer is put into a stay. It works fine for us.
 

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OK first I have to ask , have there been anymore "attacks??" Keeping the little dog "safe"
is job one. And so you know ... your pretty much "deep in it!" In Boxer world ... the "Females" are the more Dominant of two sexes???

In Boxer Rescue, Boxer rescue policy is "no female Boxers" in homes that already have a Female Boxer, a different Breed "maybe" to "experienced owners??" You should have gotten a "Male" but whatever ... your deep in it now.

That said, just so you more fully understand where you are! BTE2, is a "Pro!" I am merely a very "experienced member" of JQP." :)

And that said I have to say ... you are "Deep in it!" I have seen my "Baby Girl" nut on my Band Dawg on two occasions! I'd never seen anything like that before! But 65 lbs of crazy Boxer vs 85 lbs of American Band Dawg, I had a huge margin of error ...but you, not so much??? This is life or death for you, just to be clear.

So that said, have there been, anymore attacks since making changes??? I do understand your "trust" issues?? And it may be necessary that you send her a "crystal clear ...message that "attacking pack mates" is not aceptable!"

But baby steps, "trusting her" around the other dog is the ultimate goal. And it "may take" a "Dominant Dog Collar" or a "SLL" used as such, to send a "Crystal Clear" message that "this behaviour" will not be tolerated!

Long way of asking ... how is it going thus far???
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Not sure how the ‘?’ ended up in my last reply. It was not intended. Please forgive my typo Lindar. I sincerely appreciate your response.

Thanks for checking in on us. No attacks since making adjustments. However, the Pom and Boxer have lived together for more than three years. Until recently, we had experienced only a couple of minor incidents that I considered as little more than ‘corrections’, granted that an 80 pound ‘correction’ to a 4 pound Pom is still frightening.

I have gone over the incident in my head a thousand times and I keep coming back to what I now believe to my failures that led up to the more serious incident. As my love for the boxer grew, I was inadvertently giving her more and more privileges. That of course was a recipy for disaster. I realized that the serious incident occurred after I started letting the boxer crawl up onto my lap in the evening while watching TV. <cringe> <shame>

I now realize that that combined with all of the other mistakes that I was making was just too much for the boxer to handle. I failed her. BUT! I am working very hard to learn. I really want her to succeed, and I really want to keep my girl if at all possible. However, that said, I would rehome her in an instant (to the right home) - if I believed it was in her best interest. Her success trumps my selfish desires.

Truth be told, my wife and I honestly did research the breed quite diligently before making the commitment, but neither of us ever saw mention of aggression issues. Even when I first started researching this issue I didn’t find much information until I started being very specific with my wording of the search criteria. I have had several different breads of dogs in my lifetime, but never had issues with any dog before. I actually ignorantly thought that I was a pretty good dog parent. Of course now I realize that I was terribly mistaken and completely inept. Its painfully obvious to me now that it was only the grace of God and beauty of the character of the dogs that had saved me in the past. I now recognize my ineptitude and I’m giving it my all to learn and correct my short comings.

In short, I am very proud of my boxer girl and feel that I am making progress. She seems to be responding very well to my changes and seems all the happier for them. I can’t thank you guys enough for your advice and more importantly your support, and welcome more. I sincerely appreciate the ‘no nonsense’ advice and information that you have given to me. And I know that Junebug, my girl, appreciates you too.

Sincerely
 

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I figured it was a typo no big deal, we all make mistakes, which is one great thing about this board. While many of us are not experts our different experiences sometimes can help another. My philosophy is that dogs are dogs..as I have one small and one big I always supervise so one does not get hurt. My boxer does cream onto the bed on cold nights, lol but we really don't allow it, sometimes it happens. My daughter moved his bed further away from her bed as he was using his bed as a step to get onto hers. He never jumps up on anything. This is just him I think we are lucky with him. I am contemplating bringing a pup home and have two boxers but I'm starting to have mixed feelings about it. This boxer is just too good to be true and I could very well upset the apple cart..LOL
 

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I figured it was a typo no big deal, we all make mistakes, which is one great thing about this board. While many of us are not experts our different experiences sometimes can help another. My philosophy is that dogs are dogs..as I have one small and one big I always supervise so one does not get hurt. My boxer does cream onto the bed on cold nights, lol but we really don't allow it, sometimes it happens. My daughter moved his bed further away from her bed as he was using his bed as a step to get onto hers. He never jumps up on anything. This is just him I think we are lucky with him. I am contemplating bringing a pup home and have two boxers but I'm starting to have mixed feelings about it. This boxer is just too good to be true and I could very well upset the apple cart..LOL
Oh by and large if you've already given a "thought" to "what if I have issues" in adding another dog?? Then you won't??

You already have a better understanding of issues to look out for. Bout the only thing that may take you by surprise is ... two dogs are a pair and three dogs are a "Pack???"

Leerburg | Introducing a New Dog into a Home with Other Dogs

I stumbled unto this when I added Dog number three! And a breed I had no experience with?? My GSD ... just a big furry dog with a pointy face ... no big deal???? LOL ... I had no clue??? So you know ER hear I come????

Good times, good times, worked out well in the long run. But all of that turmoil was unnecessary??? I was really slow to realize, this crap was out of control??? And I fell back on "Formal Obedience Training," which ... did not work???


Lot's of E-Collart info which I don't use, but these days Larry is my guy. And what I did that solved my GSD's Human Aggression, which I did not "understand" I was doing at the time?? Was this.:

I "Walked him" and "ignored people" "Bubble Dog Protocol" another topic but that was it (the walk). I showed him what I wanted, worked out fine. For you ...if you want to add a "puppy" you have choices. If you have a female already as a part of your pair??? Just get another male and keep life simple. :)

Female Boxer's, much to my surprise, can be "PIA's???" The girls, are different, so owners should be clear on that point. Most likely ... that is what the "OP" stumbled unto?? If they would have gotten a "male??" They most likely would not be here?? But "crap happens." :crazyeye:
 

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Well, I dug through all of the information that you guys provided and digested it. I took a long look at myself as a pet owner, and recognized that I needed a lot of work.

No more laying on the couch.
No more sharing my ‘people food’.
No more sitting in my lap while watching TV.
No more free range in the house.
No more sleeping with me in my bed.
No more allowing her to decide when she gets attention and demanding it.
No more begging for food.
Longer and more frequent walks.

The one thing I was doing right was always using a leash when we walked and tried to keep it ‘structured’. She is pretty good on leash. She will pull a little in the beginning, but quickly realizes that I won’t tolerate it and settles down. She likes to keep tension on the leash, doesn’t generally pull too hard. I have experienced that her prey drive appears to be strong. If we jump a critter while walking she will make a strong effort to go after it. She has adapted well to being limited to a location. She is doing really well staying on, or near to, her pillow bed. All in all she seems to be much happier.

Now I am having another ‘leader’ issue. How do I regain my trust in her? How do I regain trust in her with the little Pom? We have been keeping them completely separated. Will I ever be able to trust allowing them to be together again? Would it be in everyone’s best interest to rehome my girl? I love my dog so much. The last thing I want to do is let her go. However, I also want to be a responsible pet owner. I want to help my girl succeed, not set her up to fail. Advice and opinions are very welcome.
If you are making all these changes??? Then you've already gone a long way in making necessary changes. :)

TRUST, will come with TIME. And there are two legiatment trains of thought for solving dog issues??? Either hard and fast, right freaking "NOW" corrections?? Or "Self Extinguishing Behaviours" by showing the dog, what you want and how you expect them to behave???

Crap happens, you did not sign on to become a dog trainer??? But here you are??? The past is the past, you have to "let it go!" It's what you do going forward that is important! And if you have had no more attacks??Then you have already made "appropriate, changes" in how the dog lives with you. :)

Rest assured, that if you found "A competent qualified trainer" that could actually help you?? The changes you've already made would be the ones, that they would suggest. :)

All issues start at home and how the dog lives with you. And I can pretty much guarantee, that every dog owner struggling with "Pack Issues," has "free roaming dogs in the home!" Control is key, and you can't control a dog, if you don't where they are are???

And as for "Boxer's" and "Aggression Issues??" Where there's the thing?? Generally speaking, it's not really an issue?? On here by and large we see a couple dogs a year with this issue?? On Germanshepardforum by comparison ... it was more like several issues a day!

And most likely, had you gotten a male, you'd not be here for this??? Not your fault, maybe I missed it, but near as I can tell, "Breeders" make no mention of potential, Female, Female issues with Boxers??? Rescues do and by and large their advice is just say "NO," to multi female homes, if one of those dogs is a "boxer!" So, yeah a bit late, but now you know. :devil:

But learn from others as it were and by and large all people struggling with "pack issues??" Also have "Free Roaming Dogs" in the home?? And by and large ... that works out fine, until it doesn't??? :confused:

And as for the no issues for three years?? I am curious, as to whether,either dog is fixed??? Because the three year mark would correspond to "Sexual Maturity." And that would be when one would tend to see "issues." Not that getting "fixed" is a solution. My GSD a foster fail, was already fixed when I got him. And being "fixed" had "zero impact" on his behaviour, so you know ...so much for that being a "solution." :)
 

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Yep still considering it Chip but it also has to have the right personality. I've always had 4 dogs in my house so I know how that can be. Well my bus band is on board now, s o I will take my time and decide. I love puppies but..I know what they entail.
 

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Yep still considering it Chip but it also has to have the right personality. I've always had 4 dogs in my house so I know how that can be. Well my bus band is on board now, s o I will take my time and decide. I love puppies but..I know what they entail.
LOL you have a longer memory than me. Been 15 years since I've had a puppy??? Soo I shall see I suppose?? :drinker:
 

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The Pom is 8 years old now and not fixed. Never been Bred. The Boxer is 5 years old and fixed.
Oh well ... so much for being fixed ... solving (aggression issues.)

In my case my problem child (oversize Workingline GSD) was already fixed. A foster fail, and it made zero difference to him?? But I only got seven months of trouble free life and then it was "Game On???"

Gunther passed after the last of five fights! Due to unrelated issues ... so I never got the chance to solve that "issue." :(

But when I became active online, I saw many members of JQP, making the same mistakes I did?? In all cases with "Dogs gone wrong in household Packs" the "problem dog is free roaming indoors??" That gives them the opportunity to pick the time and place of their choosing and the owner has to react to what there dog has done ... that gets old fast!

Crate and Rotate, is also a viable option ... but that just avoids the issue, it does not address it??? Control worked much better, instead of fighting behaviour I did not want, I trained a behaviour I did want??

And that worked out fine for, the next issue, Human Aggression??? Kinda like hmm ... OK this is "Not a Boxer???" Most likely with anyone else ... it would have been "back to rescue you go!" But I saw it as an opportunity for "Pay Back!"

And the rest of that story is here.:
What would my dog do? - German Shepherd Dog Forums

PO non treat based approach I realized many years later??? And all I did was, respect his choice not to be coerced into engaging with people and "Walked him" ie KISS, that's how we rolled. :)

And back on point, it sounds like you are already instituting more structure??
Beyond that train "Place" and do "Sit on the Dog" and walk her! You may not see the changes taking place immediately but it will happen. :)

And people tend to like hard numbers?? So I'd say give the new changes at least three months and then let her "earn" some privileges/freedom, back with good behaviour. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thank you for your feedback. I am definitely working on implementing all of the suggestions. I sincerely appreciate the help.
 

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Thank you for your feedback. I am definitely working on implementing all of the suggestions. I sincerely appreciate the help.
LOL, well hopefully I've helped out a little bit?? And I figure folks can learn just as much from how crap goes wrong as they can from how to get it right?? So you know ... "don't do this ..." And pretty much in every case of "Pack Issues" the problem dog is "allowed to free roam??" Czu you know ..."my other dogs ..." and so it goes. :)

But three years ... of no "apparent issues??" Yeah that has to be a record??? And if you stick around ... you will see that "Boxers" gone wrong ...is just fairly rare around here??? I'm gonna stick with maybe five or six or a year??
And I'll double down and say ... the majority of those few ... will be the girls! :crazyeye:

But institute changes towards "Structure" in the home and basis rehab towards "Walking her" and things should change. "Place, Sit on the Dog and Walking her." You may not see the changes taking place?? I id not but the dog gets it. Keep us posted and "you" can pitch in when the next "Boxer" gone wrong rolls in. :)

And for the record in many years, I've only seen one "Boxer" that you would not want to meet on a walk with your dog ... and sure enough it was a girl! But whatever ... I like the girls" so my next "Boxer" is gonna be "Single White Female" as it were. :)
 
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