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Okay...so here's the problem.  Myself and Kyle both work from 9-5pm from M-F.  Harley is taken for a walk before we leave for work and after we come home.  We also take him for a run in the evening and he is offered food in the morning but taken away as he dumps it when we're gone.  He is fed his big supper (with egg and some type of meat) at supper time and he is left with water all day except at night.  He is not kenneled when we leave but he has access to the whole house and he is given newspaper/cardboard in the basement which he does his business on.  We have a run built but are waiting to put the doggy door in so he'll eventually be able to come in and out as he pleases.  

Now our problem: Harley will usually poop twice during the day and every day we find him peeing and pooping on the paper/cardboard but we always find a "brownie" on the carpet on the opposite side of the basement.  When we are home he doesn't ask to go out and has even went as far as peeing infront of us (always on the carpet).  He once even peed in the house only 15mins after his walk.  He's a year a half old and I don't think my mom had him fully house trained.  She would let him out often enough where he never had to think about using the bathroom. How do we make him think about going to the bathroom and asking to be let out?  He's not understanding that he needs to pee and poop on a walk.  Before bed and in the morning he is taken for 20 min. walk and sometimes wouldn't pee or poop.  Or he'll pee only on the way back home.  We'd like to eventually be able to have him whine and let us know he needs to go and go as soon as he's taken outside.  He seems to have no clue what the purpose of being let outside is.  He's never tied unless we are working in the yard, so he's always walked.  I know he's getting enough exercise as we take him on good runs where he swims and runs and kicks and bucks for up to an hour or more.  

My boyfriend has thought that he couldn't smell.  We try playing hide and seek with him and he doesn't use his nose and hasn't once found his hider.  We'd walk by putrid roadkill that he wouldn't even notice and almost walk on.  We hide goodies in his food and he doesn't find them unless we show him they are in there.  Is there any "smell tests" we can do at home? If he really can't smell is this the reason he doesn't automatically pee and mark his territory like most male dogs? He doesn't sniff anything out when we are out on our walks.  He was also neutered at about 6 months and we are noticing that didn't have the chance to mentally mature before taking his "man" hormones away.  Or so we think.

We don't want to crate him as he'd be in there all day.  We realize that getting this doggy door installed would most likely help but that wouldn't solve the underlying problem he has.  He's not asking to go out even when we are there and he's not thinking for himself to realize he needs to pee and needs to be asked to be let out.  If he is asking he's giving very subtle cues that we are not picking up.  We tell him he's a good boy and give him love when he does pee outside.  We are beginning to clicker train him so any clicker training advice or ANY advice would help! I feel like a failed parent :oops:  :oops:
 

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If you allow a dog to go inside whether on newspaper or cardboard he is going to assume its *OK* to go inside.   So your potty training battle is going to be uphill IMO until you get the doggie door installed.  So an occasional "brownie" here and there really IMO again is not his fault - he does not know any better.  If he has to go he will go inside because he is given so much room.      

Solutions - 1. crate, 2. dog walker  to break up the day.   We work 9-5 and if we did not have a dog walker, most likely would not have a dog let alone 2.  Its not all that fair for them to hold it like 10-12 hours in our case because of travel to/from work.  On the crate or gated area like I do with mine, you give them limited area.  After a  morning walk my just want to sleep and they HATE to potty in their area.   If I gave them the entire house, my diningroom would be a urinal.  

So when you are home. I would try bell training.   This way he associates the bell with the door.  Go back to basics as if he were a 10 weeks puppy with potty training.    Praise and treat when you take him out to do his business.

On the smell test.  Put something in your hand like a cooked peice of chicken, a peice of a burger, close your fist.  She if he tries to get it out.   YOu have to choose something with a good aroma or they may just not pick up on it.  Also in the food, there could be a number of different smells going on that he does not even notice.  

Good Luck!
 

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I definitely think that him going to the bathroom outside actually needs a command associated with it, like "go potty" or "go pee pee", instead of just "good boy"...then once he goes, say "good potty".  That way you can teach him to actually go on command, especially when you are on walks.  If you are going to use the clicker for that, then when he goes to the bathroom, Click then treat.


As far as him letting you know that he has to go out, have you thought about putting a bell on the door?  You can teach him to hit the bell when he wants to go outside.  Boxers love to use their paws so  this is a pretty easy thing to teach IMO.

Have you thought about maybe restricting his access to the entire house, and maybe just give him access to the kitchen?
 

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wow...your dogs are lucky!  My dogs have always just held it all day no questions asked.  I don't actually think that's so much to ask...but I guess you were saying 10-12 hours, that is a lot.  But when we'd go to work (I'm not working now so not an issue lol) we'd be gone from 8:00-3:00 or so, and we definitely just made them hold it.  Tessa has the bladder of a champ, she could hold it for as long as you can imagine...11-12 hours would be no problem for her (I know, that's weird!), we don't generally let that happen though!

I've never heard of the idea of having a "spot" for them to go in the house...that is sort of just an accident waiting to happen (excuse the pun :lol: ).  When Pippin was younger, she wasn't allowed in the front room, who's door was right next to the door to go outside.  Well, when she first was let in that room she just figured it was outside too and would go in there not thinking anything of it.  We just told her that it wasn't ok every time she did it, and she wasn't allowed in there when we weren't there.  It didn't take very long to fix the problem.
 

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To train off the cardboard and the paper then IMO best to move it closer and closer to the door, then out the door.  

I think the doggie door is going to totally help alot - however just got to becareful with them having access outside when you are not home.   Bees and other elements including theft!  Sick that we live in a world where we have to worry about people steaking dogs, but unfort. Its a reality.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thank you for the responses so far! The bell sounds like a wonderful idea.  The paper thing is just temporary until we get his doggy door installed but I know of other dogs that were totally paper trained and knew the difference between the rug/floor and the paper.  Maybe we were asking too much of him.  

We were originally restricting him to the kitchen and basement but he would jump on the kitchen table presumabley so that he could see out the window there.  We gave him access to the living room because he likes to lay on the couch and he has a big window to look out of. And since then hasn't gotten into "much".  He does get into some things while we're gone like toilet paper, tampons, remote controls.  Not destructive but he does rearrange stuff.  I have a cat at my apartment that he gets along with.  Would my cat be good company for him?  The living room is the only extra space he got as the bedrooms are closed off and he doesn't go upstairs.  

Ideally we would have a dogwalker but simply can't afford to do that.  Even if we find a child that would do it for $5-10/day that would still be anywhere from an extra $100 - $200/month.  And with renovations, repairs and my tuition we just couldn't possibly afford that.  And I don't want to crate him throughout the day.  It's not really when we're at work that's the problem...that could be remedied with installing his doggy door.  What I was really concerned about was he was not associating going outside with needing to pee.  Going back to the basics is what we'll most likely have to do.  Just frustrating because we thought Harley was already house-trained!

I will take the advice about differentiating between "good boy" and "good potty" or something like that.  Could this have anything to do with him getting neutered too early? We've been noticing that he's never "manned up" and doesn't act like a typical male dog.  He has absolutely no interest in marking his territory.

Any other input (new or old) would be appreciated.
 

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Henry was neutered at 14 weeks, so I don't think that has anything to do with it.  Sounds to me like you just gotta start over.  Hand a bell from the door you want him to go out of.  Ring the bell and say "lets go potty".  When he's outside, stay out there with him.  Say "go potty" every so often.  When he goes potty, say "good potty" and give a treat.  He'll get it eventually.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thank you everyone for your helpful advice.  We have attached a bell to the door and started to ask "Do you want to go out?!".  He goes for a pee and we say "good pee" or "go pee".  Kyle brings treats on his walks to give to him when he pees.  He read somewhere that if you give them a special treat when they pee they should start peeing at the beginning of the walk so that they can get their treat.  

Oh, and no brownies yesterday! And he only went pee on his paper.  I realize that training him to go on paper isn't the most ideal but it's the only thing that works for us right now.  

He's too cute! Yesterday, he took our things to his bed.  Kyle's playstation controller that he was using the night before, my box of tampons, and one of our shirts.  He doesn't destroy anything just carries it to his bed.  Anyway, he already get's excited when we ask "Do you want to go out?!" so I'm hoping he gets just as excited when he hears the bell ring and figures out to ring it himself.
 
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